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« Conspiracy on your health?Great experience at the drive-in cinema »

Project Natal, it actually WORKS! And how Microsoft can kill the iPhone!


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    Rated 4.6/5 stars (99 votes cast)

    Yeah, I know the buzz is all around, Natal is a success. But nothing better than Jimmy Fallon demonstrating how it actually WORKs

    And I am getting one FOR SURE, there is no doubt about that! No XBOX360 would ever be complete without it

    And I am getting one FOR SURE, there is no doubt about that! No XBOX360 would ever be complete without it

    Now, here's how Microsoft can KILL the iPhone's cool multi-touch interface! Yes, using Natal in the new smart phones!

    Can you imagine a phone that dials by recognizing your hand gestures? This is straight out of Sci-Fi. You no longer need a screen, you no longer need to hold on to dear old phone form factor. Just a little display that you place on your eyes and hand gestures baby!

    I think Microsoft has topped out everyone this time. Sure, the Wiimote was AMAZING and defined a new era of interacting with games. But this thing is the technology of today.

    In the near future, we will see direct neural interaction. You play games directly from your mind.

    By the way, you know what all of this stuff means right? If not, here's a quick rundown.

    Even though this starts in games (with roots deeply embedded in military applications), this will find applications in the industry. Imagine a crane operator using same technology to move around tons of material without operating 27 livers to do that!

    Imagine a surgeon operating on a patient without touching, without disinfecting his hands, and best yet, from half the way around the world from his beach vacation spot.

    Imagine a worker handling nuclear waste from the safety of his office 2000 miles away.

    A firefighter controlling a robot battling forest fires in the middle of the forest fire while he's safely away in the fire station.

    The possibilities are unlimited... just imagine a world with no more knobs, dials, buttons, steering wheels, paddles ...etc, with no need to be in harm's way while doing your job. You just gesture your way around to do anything and everything that can be done. While escaping all the physical confines of your human body.

    Too bad for PS3! But I do have a good use for it, DOOR STOP!

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    « Conspiracy on your health?Great experience at the drive-in cinema »

    Memories....

    • #1
    • subzero
    • Windows Chrome  Browser
    • Said
    • On: 6/12/2009 2:11:49 AM
    • SpamScore=[-0.26]
    As a heavy addicted gamer since 1990 (MSX), allow me to disagree with you.

    Yes, project Natal is a novelty, indeed. It will change how games are played, probably forever.

    But..

    360 wont be the system to do that. It probably will be the third generation of MS gaming machine.

    Why?

    1) Its a new technology. Even it was out in 2010, developers still need time to actually do sth really good for it. Developers, unfortunately, are weak. A CPU a little bit different than usual, yet more powerful, made them stand still for 2 years before understanding how to develop for it. And here I mean the Cell. So lets not even imagine or think about a technology that would change the whole concept of gaming. It will take them a couple of years to understand that, and I am confident they wont get it while 360 is still alive.

    2) Even if we assume that developers r really REALLY good, or Natal is really easy to understand or program for, 360 has still no chance. Why? coz its not out of the box feature. Many of 360 users wont buy it, so most games must satisfy all owners, not those who buy Natal. In this sense, either Natal-based games will be few, or using Natal will be a side option only, which will make it lose its WOW effect.

    3) Even if we assume my 1,2 points r wrong or could be overcome, I again say 360 wont be the system to give Natal a go. Once Natal is out and there r some good games for it (again, assume my 1,2 r wrong), I assume it will be 2011 by then. Who would buy a 6 years old technology, that still uses an 11 years old technology (DVDs)? Its like buying windows XP version now! or like buying a Nokia 3300! So unless you already have a 360, Natal -by then- wont be that tempting to buy a 360 for. But ofcourse, it will be tempting to buy the very next gen for.

    In that sense, I salute MS for its step. I just hope they change the color of their Ring of Death for this technology, u know just for the fun of it! (lol).
    • #2
    • Dave
    • Apple Mac Firefox Browser
    • Said
    • On: 6/12/2009 3:51:36 AM
    • SpamScore=[-0.57]
    Leave it to Microsoft to come up with the lamest name ever for such a technology. :P
    • #3
    • Qwaider
    • Windows Internet Explorer
    • Said
    • On: 6/12/2009 4:35:36 AM
    • SpamScore=[-41.55]
    Thanks Subzero, although, being a gamer is hardly the credentials required to talk about these things. But I will still entertain the idea. I've been a gamer since the Atari 2600, perhaps this is worth something :)

    360 is already doing it, there's nothing to debate here. It's here and now.
    1) Even though it's new technology, the mechanism by which games interact is not fully related to the game. The magic is all in the controller itself.
    If there is one thing Microsoft knows how to do well (and Sony don't know how to do), it is to create simple platforms APIs for developers to hook into. That explains the explosion of games for XBOX360 vs. PS3 despite the lucrative market the Sony is behind. Cell processor is not much different than any processor. It's the gaming OS that makes the difference. Apparently MS makes a better job at that.
    2) That's not true, the Wii Fit and Guitar Hero's unusual controllers are great examples of how this is not the case. The games became instant global hits. With controllers that are not "in the box"
    Additionally, the games will mostly continue to support the older standard controllers. It's a NO-OP for developers to support this since they already do.
    3) You assume too much. The prototypes are working today. Live in front of customers. From prototype to manufacturing shouldn't take that long. We'll have to wait and see, but I am guess no later than Q4 2009. What you say completely contradict with points 1 and 2. This is happening now.
    It's a well known fact that the hardware is light-years ahead of the current software. PS2 is an example. For the best part of the last 2 years it has been outselling PS3 even though it’s what, 9 year old hardware?
    To add another nail in the coffin of this argument, consider the Wii. With processing power 1/10 that of Xbox360 or PS3. It still rules the world of entertainment, and likely to continue to do so for the next year or more. So I don't think this is even a point
    Part II of 3. DVDs, bluray and all that kind of media is going away. Online media is the future. The days of all media types are numbered anyway. (And xbox360 is already supporting that, through Netflix and their new 1080p Store, can't top that, not even through Bluray)

    Finally, for the ring of death. That was the v1 of the hardware. Very few people saw it. But for people who got the more recent hardware, didn't even have any of these issues. (I've had mine ever since the Elite came out, and never had an issue). I don't know anyone who ever had an issue. But I'm sure many people had that problem but not recently.

    @Dave, LOL, I thought it's a maternity thing at first :)
    • #4
    • subzero
    • Windows Chrome  Browser
    • Said
    • On: 6/12/2009 5:32:49 AM
    • SpamScore=[0.33]
    Being a gamer is not an enough credential, true. But it is a main credential. Despite being an Engineer, or a professor, if you are not a true gamer you cannot discuss games or gaming consoles. And our discussion right now is the proof of that: 2 true gamers, discussing what non-gamers cannot discuss.

    1) I disagree. the mechanism which games interact is FULLY related to the game. I support that by saying there is no way an old game would be played  using Natal.

    2) I had to pause a little at "Cell processor is not much different than any processor". And im still pausing.. Dont know how exactly I should comment on this!

    3) How many games r there for Wii Fit and Guitar hero? R u gonna be satisfied with only that number of games supported for Natal?

    4) If it came out in Q4 2009, I would... hmmm... Announce MS as the best gaming company of all time. I know my opinion wont make a difference, but nah :p! Its mid 2010, the soonest. I dont even feel excited for the idea that I might try it in 3 months @ Tokyo Game Show, coz I know that wont happen.

    5) The death is a trade mark for MS, not only its xbox. It happens (failing) on almost every product they launch. Thats why I expect sth similar on Natal, at least until their next service pack. Maybe xbox now doesnt have problems, but a new MS product will most likely have.
    • #5
    • Khaled
    • Windows Firefox Browser
    • Said
    • On: 6/12/2009 6:37:44 AM
    • SpamScore=[1.22]
    Project Natal is great but I think people are expecting way too much out of this. Accurate movements, great voice recognition, 3d modelling - it all sounds perfect but flaws will come. The Milo and the blonde girl video, it was all acted out (ie. she was tolled exactly what to say). IGN said when they tried it, Milo didn't understand all the questions he was asked.

    As for MS products have always been flawed, this is partially true. I mean Vista, the original Xbox, even XP for sometime. But MS got on to fix them, and now they're great. And Q4 2009 for Natal? This is still a project. It'll be Q2/Q3 2010 at least. Maybe sometime when Conviction comes out. Not that the two will be related.
    • #6
    • Qwaider
    • Windows Internet Explorer
    • Said
    • On: 6/12/2009 8:23:52 AM
    • SpamScore=[-41.57]
    Subzero, I agree. It takes a gamer. However, from a market point of view. The next generation consoles are trying to appeal to the rest of the community since there aren't many couch potatoes geek true gamers out there to make enough money out of :) So ladies’ of the house ...etc are the real target.

    RE:
    1) The demos showed Natal controlling already available interface. The XBOX menu. The gestures were simple enough and easy to understand. They even made sense! They looked like what you would think in your mind when you press a button on your remote control.
    2) Cell processor (and Xenon used in XBOX360) both come from the same Power architecture that IBM makes. Microsoft did a better job "easing" the process of developing software for the new processor, because, let's face it, Microsoft makes the most prevalent OS in the world. Running over 3 different hardware architectures and potentially capable of running over any processor architecture (like it used to run on MIPS, SPARC, ALPHA and others), this was back in the NT4 days. So how about now?
    Don't believe "hypes". Either way, it's not about Raw processing power. Although all things considered, they're both comparable by most experts.
    3) It doesn't matter how many games are there for the Fit or Guitar hero/rock band. They are hits, money making, flying off the shelves. While PS3 is collecting dust. A thing to consider though, Guitar Hero is available also on PS3 since it really is a very simple game by all means.
    4) I don't know when it will come, I'm sure we'll all know soon. But I'm not really worried about it. The day it starts shipping is the day I will get mine. Pure and simple!
    5) "The death" happens to everyone. At least Microsoft doesn't ship rootkits on their systems like Sony's scandal few years ago. If there are mistakes, they're usually unintentional.
    6) You didn’t say anything about the very successful and truly live Xbox Live. That’s a killer app by any measure. Providing downloadable content, and truly live experience propelling XBOX farther than the idiotic online experience of the PS3. It’s understandable of course, they want to sell more blu-ray. Which means downloadable media is a threat to their franchise. Sadly, these medias are in their final days.

    The most interesting thing in our discussion is that you started by saying you're an MSX gamer. Funny, MSX was also a Microsoft Platform :)

    @Khaled
    If it did 10% of what they showed, it is still awesome!
    • #7
    • subzero
    • Windows Chrome  Browser
    • Said
    • On: 6/13/2009 2:01:16 PM
    • SpamScore=[0.8]

    In Today's news, I think this link has everything I wanted to say.

    1. Its never in 2009.
    2. It wont have success on current 360.
    3. It will be a new technology to attract non-owners.

    http://www.engadget.com/2009/06/13/project-natal-basis-for-new-xbox-console-coming-fall-2010/

    • #8
    • Qwaider
    • Windows Internet Explorer
    • Said
    • On: 6/13/2009 9:42:12 PM
    • SpamScore=[-41.59]
    Subzero, this is not "news", it's a "rumor". The engadget folks spell that out clearly. Everyone is speculating. Nobody knows! Microsoft -surprisingly- keeping the whole thing under wraps and even the best analyst is left guessing!

    They did mention that other than the new controller hardware, THERE WILL BE NO NEW HARDWARE. However, a "rebrand" (Xbox Natal) is not farfetched. But utilizing existing hardware.

    You have to see the market side of things. Although old owners are a target, the REAL target is the millions of Wii users looking for the "next thing" since Wii is really, REALLY, dated technology, while Xbox has HD and a million other thing to make it better positioned to cultivate that ripe market
    Now the reason I think Microsoft is going to try to rush ship this VERY SOON, is ... By mid 2010, WiiHD (or Wii2) or whatever Sony can do WILL be unveiled AND Microsoft will lose a great opportunity to catch this market. So my money is on Microsoft releasing "something", perhaps Natal 1.0 that might not be perfect. But knowing Microsoft and how it worked for the past 30 years, this is exactly how the captured the markets.

    Imagine an XBOX Natal without controllers and being sold for $199 during the holiday season? They would sell millions
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